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I'd be curios to hear from people in other countries (or this one) as to what you think of the new health care plan or as some call it, "Obamacare:....

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I think, there is a big mistake in the logic of liberty. Neo Liberal means that not a democratic government decides but banks, insurance companies and mulitnationals NOT the poeople in the country. The only chance for the people is democracy!

Liberalism already pushed the world to the edge in 2008 and as an result in Europe now. Stop it! There must be some control of the government. Otherwise it will be a desaster, don t believe the rich telling you, taxes are bad, cause they don t want to pay them!

Best,

Olly

Nope I'm not a liberal. Hardly. I just value freedom. Governments roll isn't to take awaybmy liberty of conscience. Nor force me to pay for something like illegal alien healthcare.

I think Oliver's talking about liberalism in the modern sense, not using the US definition. 

If you see government's role as ensuring freedom then it's easy to argue the benefits of socialised healthcare. Without it people are forced into underpaid, uninspiring  work for companies that offer employee health insurance, even though employee insurance is often substandard. Socialised healthcare gives individuals the economic freedom to do the job they prefer, or become entrepreneurs, without risking the health of their families. Better to talk about practicalities like this than abstract concepts like 'liberty of conscience'.

It's a pipe dream, public healthcare is will intended, but I can't think of a single state solution that hasn't backfired completely.

Hiring the government to take care of your health is like employing a chef that can set fire to cereal.

interesting comments !  id say canada uk and europe medical systems are state solutions success stories that have delivered MORE healthcare for less $$ then we have USA maybe cuz privately owned health insurance is taking 2 trillion in profits for its shareholders?

i am in favor of people taking responiblity for their health ie no one should be covered  if they are smoking or other known harmful things

i am in favor of single payer system out of compassion  but people have to follow some health guide lines to receive it   responibility and single payer

Really? we have exponentially increasing obesity rates in UK, in combination with an ever increasing fiscal debt. And you call that successful? 

Funny our founding fathers didn't think liberty of conscience was abstract. But then they remembered government and or government/church systems that took away that privilege. I fear we've forgotten what we once stood for and why. Funny we didn't need these huge taxes and government interventions until around the 1930s or so. We managed ok. But now we have welfare and so many other things that cost and cost. I understand why people want government to do this. We just have to decide if were going to repeal our constitution and bill of rights and go a different direction. We have history o remind us of facist and socialistic government control. Do we want that? Have we forgotten Russia Romania germany under hitler and others.
Oh I pray we don't trip down those roads. Oh but we are. Already.

Healthcare in the USA has become a scam.  Doctors, dentists and for-profit healthcare professionals are now in business FOR MONEY; and when that happens, healthcare goes out the window in favor of profits. 

Now dentists use X-rays to locate "cavities," which cannot be seen by the naked eye--then they drill away half the tooth and fill it with mercury in order to fill a "cavity" that could only be seen on an X-ray!  That is one example of how stupid people here are!  We trust dentists because we are too stupid to realize that we are being scammed for money!

It's even easier for doctors to make money from "healthcare" because they can use high-tech equipment to tell us we need bypass surgery or we're going to die!  Just think of the cars that shady used car dealers could sell if they had a hook like that! 

Research has now proven that bypass surgery is an expensive and dangerous way to NON-treat heart disease.  It makes money for the doctor, but it does not cure the problem.  A diet and lifestyle change are the only things that would cure the problem--by removing the cause--but we are too stupid to realize that here in the USA.  We are too addicted to SAD to see the truth here in the USA.  So the food industry, health industry, insurance industry keep making more and more money from US healthcare--and our society continues to get sicker--because we are not curing disease--we are being scammed by healthcare professionals here in the USA.

The problem has grown to be so bad that we can no longer allow the large companies that profit from scamming us to run our healthcare...it must now be done by the government, which has the best interests of the country at heart.

The people who talk about big government being the problem are part of the "special interests" who are apparently scamming us!  They oppose "socialized medicine" because government regulations would end the ability of the "special interests" to lie, cheat, steal, scam and exploit us.  The people who do this have now become such a large part of our society that they can actually affect the opinion and the vote of large portions of our society.

It gets very complicated--but it is very simple:  For-profit healthcare is a scam!  It cannot last!  Obamacare is the first attempt of the US government to regulate this scam and put an end to exploitation by the insurance companies, lies and scams by doctors, medicare fraud, etc., etc., etc. 

The people making money from these scams amount to almost 1/2 our society!  That is why there is such opposition to Obamacare.  Plus, people in the USA are apparently so foolish, addicted, dependent and stupid that they want to continue something that is killing them and bankrupting the country!

I oppose your "freedom" to disguise your opposition to Truth as "freedom."

"Plus, people in the USA are apparently so foolish, addicted, dependent and stupid that they want to continue something that is killing them and bankrupting the country!"

Lee, I am not stupid. Neither are many of the people opposing this.  There is ALOT more to this Obamacare (thousands of pages) that you do not understand.  That none of us understand.  Perhaps you'd do well to watch the documentary 2016.  It's not what it all seems.  It's not innocent.  People have a right to not want that invasion.  And I do not profit from the medical world AT ALL.  And I am not Stupid!!  Trust me Obama could bankrupt this country. He's got a good head start.  We haven't seen anything yet.  Hang tight.
   Let's be careful before we sweepingly classify people as stupid.  There may be more to the story that will be told as we go on. 

It seems to me that there is a lot of dividing of thought going on in this(USA) country.

I think a "civil" war is being planed.. "Hang tight" is an understatement!

Also I have long held the belief that the "health care system" is just a way of harvesting returns on an investment in livestock.. Turns out cows, pigs, and chickens aren't the only animals in the factory farm!

"Sir, you have cancer. We can try to cut it out and poison your body with chemicals and radiation. This may keep you alive longer and will only cost all the money you have. So do you want to die right now, or stay alive a little longer to be with your loved ones?"  -Dr. so-or-who to patient who-or-what.

We spend our whole lives hording wealth only to have it "harvested" by the "health care system" The matrix is a scary place to be for sure! At least we have each other, vegans, raw fooders, UNITE! DON"T FIGHT!!

There are things which work better ruled by government and things which arent. At least this is what I see in Germany. Better ruled by the government is e.g. police, school, fire department, miltary. This is why we have to pay taxes. Hope you agree.
Here there are some things they try to privatize and work much worse then. This is Public Transport and health care.
As I work in the health care system, I can tell. Perhaps I would earn more if we had a more liberal System, but I think it's good that everybody has acces to basic medical treatments.
But why does it work worse, when it gets more private that means more capitalsitic.
Because it's about helping humans and this is what most try to do when it's govrnmentt ruled. When its a privat "factory" they just think about how to get the most money. So they try to unnecessary stuff with wealthy patients and the poor dont get the treatment they need...

Just an outside point of view. I like the American ideal of freedom, but in my opinion, here it's on the target beyond...

 I agree with entirely. 

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