30 Bananas a Day!

strange crazy disturbing dreams and provocative questions about veganism and stuff

Hello, everyone! Please take a time to answer this since it's extremely important to me. This is my first post, so I'm really sorry if it's much too long, so if you wanna go straight to the point please fell free to read only the highlighted parts. I'll be presently moving parts of it to a blog post.

I've been an ethical vegan for the last 3 years by now - and absolutely no intention of going back! The only (possible) exceptions to the rule were when I ate something without knowing the exact ingredients of it [perhaps bcs I was very hungry at the time; I've always been in the habit of checking all ingredients of what I ate as much as possible though; I can remember once when I was in Germany (where I took my profile picture!) I was very hungry so stoped in a museum cafeteria and ate a potato soup that I'm not sure if it had milk on it (or even worse; God, I hope not...); anyways I felt a bit strange after eating it but prefered not to ask]; the closest I got to breaking up with veganism recently was a day (I was in the Netherlands then) when my mother bought me a tomato soup in a chinese (or japanese, I duno) restaurant that had chicken on it (ugh...she probably didn't know it so please forgive her); I had literaly been day-dreaming of tomatos all day long and regreting I didn't buy any when I could  (I was at that moment in a house very far away from the nearest supermarket (well, to say the truth I didn't really ask where it was but at least that's pretty much the impression I got)), so I opened the glass (yeah, it came in a plastic glass...) and saw some weird things that I didn't know what they were (I mean it looked like chicken, but could also have been some kind of imitation; tofu, perhaps? unlikely for a non-vegan restaurant I think, but still who knows), so after a while I took a spoonful of it and aproached my tongue so I could better fell the texture of it, but imediately refused to eat it; it just looked too much like the real thing to me.

The weird thing is I had had a nightmare a little less than a month before, that was more or less like this: my mother kept offering me things that I don't eat and asking in a sweet voice: 'you will eat this, will you?' and I obediently answered: 'yes I will'; I was sitting on a table with some other people and my mother would keep giving me the rests of other peoples plates I and would eat it all! the dream culminated with me eating chicken leftovers from other peoples plates (yeah, disgusting...). The subsequent days were like a come true of that dream: I started eating more and more cooked food, increasingly spicy and salty; until one day I felt so bad and couldn't sleep and decided to go back to LFRV; I did it for a few days and felt like heaven, better than ever before, but then my mother prepared some (frozen and cooked) petit pois (green peas) and since my fruit stock was near depletion, I decided - after quite a deal of hesitation - to eat it; it was like opening the gates of hell for all demons to come out; and in the next days I ate more and more crap aka rubish aka cooked matter (yeah that stuff aint even food); there was even a day when I ate two pieces of bread taken from a litter bin! (yeah, thats the truth... I was very hungry and I saw they looked clean and still a bit warm and thought it was a waste to just throw away two 'nice' pieces of bread and so on and so I just took them and ate them... yeah, call me crazy if you want; and I kept thinking: 'I'm already a walking litter bin anyways so what's the matter of eating something coming from a litter bin?'). 

I'd like to give you some background on the chicken dream (or rather, nightmare...). I have spent a month of vacations in Paris with my mother and a friend of hers who is a non-vegetarian with a very strange (imo) view of vegetarianism, cause she once 'd a boyfriend who would only eat vegetarian and organic and who was (according to her) a psycopath, so she'd absolutely refuse to eat anything that was organic or vegetarian; she declared in no uncertain terms that she needed meat; once we went to biocoop (an organic store) with her and she felt very bad just to be in there; she ended up buying some eggs and all

non-vegan stuff she could find (in the store). Considering her views on vegetarianism, I think you can guess how she viewed the LFRV diet: she thought of course 'u cant live only on fruit', like so many people do. Plus, my mother declared repeatedly that I shouldn't buy so many fruit because there was not enough room in the appartement... So, yeah, it was complicated... and I ended up eating lots of crap. One day I went to biocoop with my mother and she said she was gonna buy a tofu with all kinds of spices in it and she asked me if I would eat it; and I thought to myself: 'hell, I'm already eating all sorts of crap, so what sort of difference can it make' and I said 'yes'! That's where the question from the dream came from.

 

Then a day me and my mother arrived home and my mother's friend 'd prepared a soup and all the house was stinking like dead chicken, and she was siting there and eating it; and she greeted us and offered us a bit of the soup and we politely refused, and she kept offering it and offering it and we continued to refuse it, so she came with the argument that if I were in a desert island, where there are not enough plant food, I'd be forced to eat animals to survive; then I simply said I'm not currently in this island so there is not need for eating animals for survival at the moment; and she responded by saying that I could one day be in such an island, and we should be prepared for that, and that's why 'we cant be radicals'; and I responded by saying that I couldn't see how eating animals now could possibly be preparation for a hypothetical (and highly unlikely, by the way) future situation in which I would find myself in a desert island having to eat other animals to survive, that what I eat now has little bearing on what I'll eat in the future and hardly constitutes preparation for it, and that that was a silly and nonsensic argument cause it would also require us, were it valid, to eat larvae and vermine and all sorts of stuff and eat poo and drink pee and the like; and she started geting angrier but persisted with her argument; so I declared that if I actually found myself in a situation in which the only means of survival were sacrificing my fellow creatures, I'd rather die than kill. Actually, I confess I was also geting very nervous with this conversation and with all the smell that was in the air, so I shouted this at her and she said that's it and I couldn't treat her like that cos noone had ever treated her like that not even her mother and I had to learn to respect her cause she respected me, and she simply packed her things in the middle of the night and went away without anymore. I was so ashamed and embarassed that for a while a really thought I'd some kind of serious problem, that perhaps I was wrong in being a vegan, that perhaps we should eat meat after all, that I should look for a  philosopher to teach me why is it that we have the moral obligation of eating meat...

So, now I have just woken up from a very strange and most disturbing dream: I was reading a post (or watching a movie) from someone here on 30 bad who was defending meat-eating!!...  (yeah, seriously); as I can remember, he was saying that in the begining, vegans would only be able to eat one egg at a time, but then their 'meat aversion' (as he put it) would gradualy fade away and they would start including more 'generous' portions (he used this exact wording) of meat in their plates and that this would increase the 'nutritional value' of their meals. He argued that since meat 'tastes good', there must be some nutritional value to it; that if we weren't meant to eat it, it wouldn't 'taste good' to our palates.


Now, the 'one egg at a time' stuff clearly refers to the memory of one of Harley's videos where he mentioned that Westney Price recomended eating one egg a day or a piece of meat the size of an egg a day, whereas the talk about 'overcoming the meat aversion' stems from a discussion I once read on a paleo forum of a guy who wanted to do a vegetarian version of the paleo diet, and everyone (including himself) was saying this was an emotional choice, not a rational one and that if he was really gonna do that, he should absolutely not skip his daily dose of eggs, since it was his only source of B12; then they started a discussion about people who'd been vegan previously to trying the paleo stuff, wether they'd like to go back to vegan, and they enthusiasticaly said no, 'going back to vegan would be like going back to live with my parents', and about how diff it was to overcome the so-called 'meat-aversion' after one goes vegan. Needlees to say, I was most disturbed by these comments. I find it very sad that some people see veganism as some sort of 'childish thing'; i know a guy who is a corpse-eater and who says he used to be vegetarian when he was 'young and innocent' and quit it cos according to him it was 'just not practical in business trips', that you could offend your business partners if you didn't eat what they expect you to (a pretty lame excuse since I know of many warriors here who are low-fat raw vegan businessmen - or women).

The truth is: I've always been ashamed - and I still am quite a bit- of being a vegan, ashamed of openly declaring it unless asked. Yes, you've heard it right, I'm ashamed of not being a murderer while living in a society in which murdering and torturing sweet innocent creatures is considered the norm and you're thought to have a problem if you think otherwise; and I'm ashamed of being ashamed of it... (tears come to my eyes as I write this)

I am trying to figure out what is the meaning of this dream, why did I dream it. I think its probably due to some kind of nutrient defficiency; I've been eating quite poorly lately and yesterday was the s***iest day of all; I've been mostly 100% LFRV the last few days but I've been chronically undereating; also I've been sleeping poorly; fortunately I've been drinking quite alot of water (maybe 6l/day) and this seems to be helping me alot; also  I haven't been geting enough sodium from the diet (I haven't  been eating celery nor drinking coconut water lately), which makes me binge on salt; last night I ate some rice and red lentils with curry and onions and garlic and etc etc which my mother left in the pan (about a third or a fourth of a regular person's meal) and I added a lot (I mean a lot) of red pepper to it and also lemon; i haven't been eating any garlic or onion for several months by now (ok, perhaps a lil bit here and there, but not a regular thing; I've been avoiding it as much as possible, I think) and not eating cooked stuff for a few days (except that I'd eaten half a spoon of those lentils earlier cos my mother asked me to see if it was spoiled and also some spoonfuls here and there). I didn't feel too bad after eating it, probably bcs it was not so large a quantity. I also ate some red (quite spicy) peppers (by themselves). I have been loving to eat peppers lately.

So, after all this talk I have a few questions for you:


  1. What do you think of the argument that if something tastes good, then it has some nutritional value? That if it tastes good, then it means it's meant to be eaten? (I know this very argument's been sometimes used in support of eating fruit (and against eating other stuff cos it doesn taste so gud (starches,for instance)))
  2. I've been a vegan for 3 years by now, so I really can't remember the taste of meat (including poultry and fish). I woke up from my dream rather curious about how it'd taste like. So, I'd like to ask to those of you who can still remember, to answer in all sincerity: does it taste good? I've always thought meat would taste pretty awful by itself, that you'd have to add a lot of stuff to it for it to have a bearable taste,but I'd like to hear different opinions; I remember when I used to eat dead corpses, I used to think that being born without taste buds wouldv been a gift! (gladly this has changed and now i just luv luv luv the food I eat and that I can actually call food :) )
  3. On the topic of 'tasting good', why is it that things like onions, garlic, etc (seem to) taste 'good' to some (many) people if theyre toxic to us? Why is it that adding salt or spices to smthng that would taste pretty b(l)a(n)d by itself (e.g. rice) makes it taste better? Could it be that we're not prepared to analyse complex foods (i.e. mixtures) by their taste so its possible to 'fool' our taste buds in this way? One would expect that primitive men would eat (almost) only simple foods, so it seems reasonable that our palate should only be prepared to understand these kinds of foods.
  4. As I said before, I've been loving to eat peppers lately, even by themselves; I feel they warm me up inside. However, I understand opinions are very divided here regarding things like peppers and lemons, cos 'you cant make a meal outta them', which I think is a good argument, but I'd like to hear your opinion, specifically: what do you think of the above argument, whats its strenght to what extent is it applicable? what do you think of peppers and lemons (and ginger, curcuma, etc...)? should we eat them? should we avoid them? why or why not? I'd like to hear arguments both pro and against.

I thank you very much for taking the time and trouble to read and answer. I hope this was not too long and tiresome. I know this all may sound like a huge complaint but I desire not to complain but merely to tell my story and ask for your thoughts on it. I'll be forever indebted for those who hear me and express their own ideas about my thoughts cos its tough to find someone that can giv you attention these days.
luv <3 

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Depends on how you view it I guess. A dreaming teacher may be more accurate, but doesn't negate the possibility they are negative. Carlo castenado (or whatever his name is) talked about inorganic beings who would try and teach people in their dreams as a way to lure them to there world and they would exchange lessons for the people's energy in the form of experiences, and they would very often appear to dreamers as friends or relatives, often family members. Some people might not think of that as a negative situation but it had severe consequences for carlos and don juan avoided the beings like the plague because he knew of the risks. There definitely is the possibility that this is just a test, Ive definitely had lots of these types of tests in my dreams, super hard to pass for some weird reason. I did pass one one time, I think I went lucid for a short time but there's kind of a gap missing. I definitely think there is interference with people's dreams from negative beings, though, shared dreams are definitely real and I've had experiences with foreign elements in the past so I wouldn't totally dismiss the possibility.

I'm sorry for my ignorance but I really have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I would be very much glad if you could give me some light.

As for lucid dreaming, I've heard of it and it's my dream to practice it. So if you could teach me something about it, I'd be so thankful!

luv n affection <3

First of all, I'd like to thank of all my heart all of those who have taken their time and trouble to read and answer my post. I've honestly never gotten so much love and attention in all my life, so I'm really moved; I can't find the words to express my gratitude towards you; in fact I think no words can fully express my indebtedness.

I know I may sound false or silly talking like this, but it's been the first the time in all my life I get to talk about the things that are dearest to me with people that can actually understand me and hear me and give significant answers to my questions. It's been the first time I meet so many people who think alike me. I'm so happy I can't stop crying. I really cant express how much I owe u all. I hope you aint to bothered by all this emotive talk, but when I wrote this post I sincerely thought it would be forgotten, that I would never get an answer, and yet I get already several answer from sincerely commited and interested people in the very same day!

You know, I've been so vibrantely happy since I started my path in the LFRV lifestyle. I used to have chronic nose congestion with a constant flow from my nose and now its totaly gone (just sometimes when I eat cooked crap poison food, I feel my nose a bit full of stuff, but even then there's no longer the constant flow i used to have); for the first time in my life, I feel that i can breathe. I used to suffer from lack of energy which I thought was just laziness and now I'm not yet 100% but it doesn't even compare to what it was. I used to have frequent suicidal thoughts and now I've known a love of life I couldn't previously dream of.  I feel a connection with the earth and all things and living beings much much much stronger that ever ever before; now I can see any living being, even an insect, even fruit flies or larvae as an equal and share my food with them (I once found a little friend of mine inside a strawbery and I would keep him/her inside a little box and buy strawberries just to feed him; I even hid him inside my coat and took him in a plane trip; I was so sad when I forgot him in the Netherlands before taking the plane back home; he probably went to litter bin :(   ) .

I can feel in myself the love and vibrancy that permeates all living beings in a way never before felt. And now i've found a whole community of people who think just like me and who are sincerely devoted to helping one another, who are not mean and selfish like so many people and most importantly, who do not think that if you're not mean and selfish then you must have some kind of serious problem or suffer from some kind of serious illness. This is the first time in all my life I've found a place where I can genuinely be myself, where I don't have to pretend I'm someone else, where I don't have to be ashamed or afraid of showing myself fully, where I'm not seen as the strange, the different, the crazy, the problematic, the mentally ill, the wrong, where I don't have to fear being reproached or condemned for my actions or opinions and views. u see, all my life it seems the whole world's been working against me, although I know this is really not true and my greatest enemy is realy just myself. I can now feel how blessed I am and we all are of living in such a wonderful world sharing such a wonderful experience which is life.

It seems difficult to believe that so many (if not most) of the problems that afflict humanity and human beings stem from the simple fact that were following the wrong diet/lifestyle. How can it be that simple?! and that beautiful?! u know, fruit's always been there but I never noticed it. I used to eat very little fruit previously to discovering the LFRV diet/lifestyle. I've always seen it as some kind of forbiden thing; I used to feel guilty when I ate fruit cus it tasted just so good! things are not meant to to taste that good, to feel that good, to be that good; we're not meant to feel that much pleasure; or at least that's what we're taught. I still feel guilt when I eat fruit but now I try to eat it as a staple cus I've understood its the correct food for humans. I can tell it from my own experience, and from that of so many other people here...

I have been feeling far more happiness and joy than I'm able to deal with; sometimes, when I think I've found the path to joy and health and radiance and full realisation, I just start to laugh and cry uncontrolably; once my godmother saw me like this and she said she was very worried about me and thought I was going crazy; my mother has told me that i've been to 'unstable' lately.

Well, this comment is geting a bit too long so I guess I'll stop here. I will post other comments along the way and also answer the comments individualy. As I said previously, I'm new to this forum so I don't really know what's the acceptable size ov a comment; so I'd be glad to get feedback on that too.

I hope I don't seem like an uncontrolable talker or something of the kind. It's just that for the first time I am able to talk things that have been kept locked and buried deep and hidden for so long... and just crave for their freedom.

I love you all very very deeply.

love and affection <3

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