Wanting desperately to know what happened to a fellow faster of mine named Jonathan. He was severely underweight and he fasted at the same time that I did under the supervision of Loren Lockman. Anyone happen to know what happened and what went down? We all want and kind of need to know as we all will or have fasted one time or another.
This is very disturbing to say the least and if we get the truth it shall make things more clear.
Jon was a very smart man in his thrities and he was married. He talked very highly of his life with his wife in COlorado. He missed her very very much and it was all he liked to talk about. He kept telling me how much his wife begged for him to come home..I toldhim to break the fast if he didn't feel like going the full 32(which he did) if he was not up to it) he said Loren reassured him that he was okay.
Loren never checked for Potassium or anything major..Even when I brought it up Loren disputed it. I tild him I read it in Dr Fuhrman;s booka nd he said that Fuhrman didn't know much b/c he was "just an M.D." as he liked to put it.
I am very very heartbroken for Jon's family now and I feel like I lost a good friend.
I am weeping since I heard of this terrible news this morning..Even worse not knowing the details..
I think it is the right thing to do and come forward and tell us what you know if you do know what happened...there is nothing more upsetting than drawing your own creepy conclusions.
Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeez tell us what you know! Anyone????????????
Bella just posted some cautionaries about fasting, including specifically Loren's operation:
She correctly notes that any longterm fasting should be under proper supervision.
Yes, by the way the video by Fred P. mentioned by Bella was taken down 1 year ago. In that post Bella also mentions another death in a fasting center, probably she means at Douglas Graham's. Fasting is a very hard matter, it' not to be taken easily, please read for example here: http://30bananasadaysucks.com/2012/03/what-they-dont-tell-you-about...
As for Lockman, I cannot believe he is still working in th health field. I was told he gave a talk last night in Santa Cruz, California, at Cafe Gratitude!!!
Judging by the author´s conclusions on the subject of fasting, as well as those who subsequently followed, it is easily perceivable that fasting is highly misunderstood, even if by the seemingly educated.
Equanting fasting with starvation, and failing to recognize the epitome importance of fasting versus a juice diet in the treatment of the very sick, are perfect examples of such misapprehensions.
In addition, and despite some relevant points made up in that article, the rest of the website´s content, is nothing but an exercise of ignorance.
"Johnathan didnt need to fast IMHO. Guys that light that fast...its just not worth it. If your that light and not a fast runner then you have got that light via failure to thrive. If I undereat for a few days my life quality goes downhill. Most fasters on this lifestyle are undereating, under drinking, under sleeping and feeling dodgy and they think a fast will help them. Its a bit like drilling holes in your bike frame cos you think its not light enough but its already light enough realistically."
Actually, Jonathan WAS a runner. And loved hiking to the top of nearby Longs Peak, a 14,000 ft mountain that is the most difficult non-technical climb that can be done (as tough as it gets without needing to have ropes and equipment). I tried once but could not make it to the top, and felt like I'd been run over by a truck for days afterwards. Jonathan was in great shape, muscle-wise, he just had no fat at all.
BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY --------
I was just poking around the internet on different sites, and came across this snippet on one of the comment threads -
"He [Loren Lockman] is now in Costa Rica, after he fled from Panama due to legal issues and the loss of his business and property there."
While I'm sorry he's managed to set up his "business" again in Costa Rica, I have to say I am smiling right now to know that at least he didn't get off scot-free from his blatant medical negligence in the case of Jonathan's death!
Under-eating is a form of “starvation diet”, can kill you in 14-16 days easily. Water-only fasting has NOTHING to do with your opinions.
Brushing your teeth with flavored toothpaste during a water only fast can convert the fast that can benefit you every day through day 60 to a starvation diet that will hurt your health before day 10, and could kill you. The flavor of the toothpaste or herbal tea will start up your dormant digestive system, causing you to digest yourself with all those powerful acids on an empty stomach and colon (yes, this last statement is “oversimplified”...but accurate enough for illustrative purposes.
There is a production company that is doing a six part series for Netflix called "Well". One of the episodes is on the amazing benefits of water fasting. But they also wanted to show the risks, so they flew out to Colorado and spent a day interviewing me about what happened with Jonathan. I don't know how much will make it into the episode, but I do know that they then flew to Costa Rica and interviewed Loren, who feels absolutely NO responsibility and NO remorse over what happened with Jonathan. Having just been re-immersed in everything that happened, I've taken the time to put together everything that I have and to tell his story. You can read it at http://www.coloradoexplorers.com/loren-lockman-tanglewood-is-danger...
In my younger years, I did a dozen or so water only fasts of about 22 days, and from age 50 (when I did 49 days) I have done 16 annual fasts, 4 of them in excess of 40 days (using Dr Fuhrmans book as my “Bible”).
3 years ago I went to Thailand, checked into a Hot Springs Resort for a 62 day fast, but started having nausea from say 30 on....which is very unusual for me...usually I can hike 10-15 miles at 8,000 to 10,000 ft up in the Rockies at day 35.
It turns out that I had caused a Potassium deficiency by doing some early coffee enemas (which was something I usually do NOT do)...and found out that coffee enemas will cause this deficiency.
I researched what I could do to get Potassium into me while fasting, and my research showed that there were no alternatives that could be done safely and quickly in Thailand...so I broke the fast at day 36, happy that the 6 days of enduring that deficiency did not bring on any heart issues.
Not to debate, nor advocate...I have found that for myself....enemas are a determining factor of being able to work construction until day 40 on a fast...or feel like crap and being bed bound from day 20 or so....but excessive enemas are to be avoided. The last dozen years have been an experiment to determine the minimum amount to do each week...and NOT do coffee ones at all on a water only fast.
Before embarking on a fast now, I do pay attention to my Potassium intake, I now do several days of liquid only and then clear liquid (like strained juices and vegetable broths) as I Segway into the water only segment (my count starts with first day of water only...but now I have my empty colon....and further minimizing a need for enemas.
Now, I gotta reinforce that newbies (first 10 years) should never attempt a prolonged water only fast without experienced supervision. If you have been 90-100% raw for 2 years or more, then you will have less “issues”....but anything over 5 days in year 2-5 or over 10 days should be supervised.
I have several ”protocol” red flags that will cease the fast IMMEDIATELY...and wherever I go, I do ask those around me to observe me about those “things”. (I am being intentionally vague about this so I will not influence someone to embark without supervision)
My shortest fast in the last 35 years was last year: 10 days.
Intermittent fasting (18 hours to 24 hours between meals) done 2-3 times a week all year can trigger the body to have most of the benefits of a longer fast (the body using stem cell for healing)...with 72 hour fasts being optimal (but not done often).
Intermittent fasting Is extremely difficult for me to observe, don’t really know why. “Dry Fasting” is also more powerful than Intermittent water only...but better done in humid climates...and 18 hours seems to be the outside limit of it benefitting your healing.
Ramadan is 30 days or so of “Dry Fasting”, but in affluent Islamic countries, it is often practiced with food orgies pre-dawn and bigger food orgies after sunset, causing more digestive health issue visits to hospitals. I may try it one year soon...but not for Religious purpose.
Am posting this without proofreading, so sorry for any misspellings or grammatical errors...gotta get to work...
Can you please clarify - are you making some sort of point about Jonathan, about Tanglewood, about both, about neither?....
If you are asking about my post, fair question.
NEITHER...though I am greatly disturbed about all the misconceptions of the types and process and results of fasting.
I had not realized that I came in at “Page 4” of this thread, and now see that my post is a little to a lot “out of context”...and I apologize for that.
I do have experience with the electrolyte imbalances, and do really well by making sure I do the colloidal minerals heavily (already perfectly balanced for life)for weeks before a fast...but had inadvertently CAUSED my Potassium imbalance.
Simply doing fasts and being led through fasts does not give all the insight needed, I had 25 years of active fasting and was still learning more each year than I knew after reading a dozen books...and am still learning.
Only recently have I learned the dynamics of why rapid healing happens during an extended water fast that exceeds a raw diet by many times only. (Given choice of the 2, I would be back on a 100% raw diet, it healed me in ways that medical science told me I would never recover....but the water only fast of 49 days cleared up 50 or more things that I never expected to get better)....my motivation for that fast was seeing myself a couple of months from being in a wheelchair from PN....which did clear up 95% immediately.
When I was 65, I was hit by a car and thrown 18 ft, and a year and a half later am still goimg theough the dozen healing protocols. While there are days I cannot get the 12 ft to the bathroom and back, there are good days also...like doing the 2day ascend-descend of Mt Fuji in one day last year.
i have the confidence in fasting and raw food (and 8 ounces of wheat grass juice a day) and all the other lifestyle choices that I have started strength training for my biggest climb yet, the 20-27 day climb up Aconcagua (Argentina, 23,000 ft) the highest peak outside of the Himalayas...and in 15 months I intend to “bag” it without guides, porters or oxygen (yes, I have extensive endurance and extreme altitude experience)..
I will do it Solo unless my wife chooses to come also (she is more extreme than me, and younger, only 60).
I love to promote the concept of fasting...but will enthusiastically discourage someone from attempting one without extensive knowledge...or guidance on a longer one.