I can not see any logical reason why one would believe in a god as there is no evidence for an actual god existing. That's why I wonder why so many people believe in a god.
So why do you believe in a god? :)
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Since I was literally 2 years old (genious child) I have been studying Astronomy, Palaeontology, Biology, Geology, Cosmology, Physics, Astro-Physics, Chemistry, Quantum Mechanics, etc, etc, etc...
Believe me when I say...
I would need to forget 99.9999141592653589% of what I know about the Universe & everything in it, before I would be clueless enough or uneducated enough to entertain the possibility that something like a god was even mildly plausible.
Gods come from the mind of men. From primitive minds that fail to understand how the wind can blow without a mystical hand to give it a push.
I'm the type of person who absolutely does not EVER open his mouth until I know that I am right. The following is not my opinion, it is 100% irrevocably factual...
There is no 'God'. Anyone who believes in ANY God, does not know enough about the universe. Those people need to go and do a couple more decades of research.
Throughout most of my life, I have been completely astonished by most people's seemingly endless ability to FAIL to see what is staring them straight in the face. People can see something that has an obvious, simple cause & effect right in front of them and they'll go off on this wild fairy-tale tangent to try to explain what they clearly do not understand. And don't think Astrophysicists are smart enough to be immune to such buffoonery, "We can't account for or detect everything in the universe, so it has to be hidden in other dimensions..."
I've been doing my research on this stuff for more than quarter of a century. Anyone is welcome to ask me where the idea of gods came from, or how mainstream religion got to where it is today. I'll tell you straight.
more deep meditation and real phenomenon derivated from it and less intellectual thinking. For sure you know the Gödel theorem, it proves that formal thinking has deep limits. And the limits of empirical sciencies are quite evident by themselves since borh and friends created quamtum physics.
If you are sure that god doesn't exist then neither thoughts, and this is nonsense for me. And I am not saying what is god, key point here.
Indeed science is, in itself, it's own limiting factor.
All that I know has taught me not to rely completely on science for my views of the universe.
I firmly believe we will never see past the quantum, we will never be able to see the smallest details of the universe and manipulate it's very construct. The universe is an unstoppable ecosystem of constant turnover that just can't be trifled with, no matter how much we know.
Can you prove that God doesn't exist, that he "comes from the minds of men?"
Maybe you can give us a simple version of your argument here?
"I'm a genius and this is what I think (even though other geniuses think I'm wrong)" isn't much of an argument...
Aw... I thought that was a real quote. That would have been cool!
Instead it was the mockery of an argument made by someone explaining why they don't find premise to believe.
Hi Zeta, but shall we keep in mind...we are very limited as mankind, and that's where God comes in. He's riding on the outside of that scientific circle we created with our limited understanding.
God comes in. He's riding on the outside of that scientific circle we created with our limited understanding.
And yet, every time we have expanded that limited circle into area that theists told us God resided, he was nowhere to be found.
Every time. Without exception.
With a track record like that, it begs credulity to assume there's a god just around the next vacuum fluctuation.
It says in the Mahabharat, a famous and hugely popular spiritual classic from India:
"Logic and discourse are inconclusive. A person whose opinion does not differ from others is not considered a great sage. Merely by studying the Vedas, which are wide-ranging, one cannot come to the correct spiritual path. Knowledge of this path is hidden in the heart of a self-realized person (mahäjana). Consequently, one should accept whatever path these self-realized persons advocate."
Mahabharata, Vana-parva, 313.117
Human beings can know some tiny bit about truth by logic and inductive reasoning, but definitely not everything. That's just how it is.
"Merely by studying the Vedas, which are wide-ranging, one cannot come to the correct spiritual path. Knowledge of this path is hidden in the heart of a self-realized person."
BINGO. We have a winner. The answers are in the universe around you. This coming from the oldest known written religious doctrine known to man. Has anyone ever found written in the bible 'All the answers to the path CANNOT be found in this book'... ?
"Human beings can know some tiny bit about truth by logic and inductive reasoning, but definitely not everything. That's just how it is."
I know more than most people can ever imagine, and with as much as I know about the universe, I can tell you that you are absolutely correct in this line of thinking. All the collective knowledge of the infinite universe, the knowledge of every living thing collected throughout all of time will NEVER amount to All there is to know.
I will be the first person to gladly tell anybody that science is looking down a bottomless hole with a flashlight.
"Can you prove that God doesn't exist, that he 'comes from the minds of men'?"
Is God in the thoughts of a Koala ? Does a Cheetah stop to say grace before stalking and tackling his prey? These are the thoughts of Humans, not nature. Gods are nothing more than stories passed down through the ages.
You said it yourself, even the Mahabharat states that "Knowledge of this path is hidden in the heart of a self-realized person."
The answers to the universe's 'spirituality' are right in front of you to find, in the heart of anyone who has opened their eyes and connected with the universe around them. Anyone with an open mind and honest heart can find truth, even whilst subjugated by narrow-minded lies.
"Is God in the thoughts of a Koala ? Does a Cheetah stop to say grace before stalking and tackling his prey? These are the thoughts of Humans, not nature.
Wait, so the only things that are true and real are the things Koalas and Cheetahs can think ok... Hmmm, what about truths in chemisty and quantum mechanics, etc.? Are they false or just human imagination because animals can't think of them?
"Gods are nothing more than stories passed down through the ages."
I don't understand why something which has been accepted for countless generations is automatically false just because they're old ideas.
I think a lot of people here have already admitted that if you're just using tools like like logic and argument, your discussion about the existence of God will end in a stalemate. You won't prove it either way.
So who's proven that the existence of God is wrong?
"we continue to prove ourselves wrong every day"
Someone used to think the earth was flat, and know we laugh at that dumb old idea. In 50, 100, 200 years people will look at the scientific theories that are popular now and laugh too.
So who's proven that the existence of God is wrong?
I don't think anyone need to prove anything in terms of belief. It is a personal matter. I do however feel that religious people put themselves up on pedestals because of their belief, when in fact most modern religions ask of the individual to forgive.
In ancient Greek mythology, putting yourself above others spiritually was deemed as hubris, punishable by nemesis, because you cannot rule over others simply by believing something they don't believe in.
I've often been patronized by Christians, when I told them that I have yet to be thoroughly convinced of the Bible's teachings of God. Having gone through Bible studies as a child, I know that is not the proper disposition of a Christian.
Buddhism or even Hinduism seem better matched with my secular humanistic thoughts, but I don't believe that organized religion is the way to go. If you cannot be Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc. on your own, are you at all honoring your congregation?