I too have been a grumblie about the lack of results on the diet. I have neither gained nor lost weight, but at 35%+ fat percentile, exact same height and similar build to Freelee, I need and want to!
So I read Dr Graham's book again after 3 years. Reading it is something we agree to in joining as a member...remember? Most of it I am well versed in, but this passage jumped out at me - p239 (slightly abbreviated))
Why didn't the 80/10/10 work for me?
I Less than 2% of your calories come from vegetables and leafy greens. eg on a 2000 calorie diet, 1lb greens minimum.
2) Caloric intake is insufficient to maintain desired bodyweight.
3) YOU BURN LESS THAN 40% OF YOUR CALORIES IN PHYSICAL ACTIVITY. ON 2000 CAL/DAY, A MINIMUM OF 800 CALORIES.
4) Habitual sleep pattern is insufficient. (You can fail to gain muscle, or fail to lose fat, if underslept).
5) You eat all day long, rather tha 1-4 meals per day.
6) You lack emotional poise (your adrenals are overexerted, which causes the body to hold on to fat stores).
7) You expose your unclothed skin to sunlight less than 30 mins a day.
This was something I had forgotten since first reading. Although I work out 2 hrs/day, I am then sedentary at work. I clearly need to work out more intensely, or be more active outside workout hours. The minimum recommendation here is 2500 - which means1100+ burned, every day we eat.
Do you need to re-read The 18/10/10 Diet, or read for the first time?
(disclaimer: everything written below is my opinion. I am not a medical professional; just a logical thinker.)
Here's how I see it, and please correct me if I'm wrong:
After realizing the apparent facts that relate to Kate's situation and understanding that the majority of individuals (healthy or unhealthy) who integrate the 80/10/10 lifestyle; combined with consistent exercise, consistent water uptake, consistent sleep, consistent lowered stress levels, and vitamin D and B-12 replenishment have proven to lose weight and fix a large majority of their health issues: We can only assume that Kate may have an underlying health problem that will not be fixed no matter what food she eats or how frequently she moves her blood (exercise).
If in fact she does have an underlying health issue, eating food of any kind will not speed the recovery of said issue. Every time you eat, regardless of what matter you place into your digestive system, energy is needed to break down and distribute said matter. The longer the food takes to digest, the more energy is needed in the process of digestion.
Now, we can all agree that food groups that are opposite of what our bodies are physiologically designed to process (meat, dairy, wheat, deep fried ice cream yum yum bars, toxic lab created sludge puppies, etc), will never help her health and may in fact reduce the speed of her recovery or even increase the speed of future ailments.
If in fact she has been eating nothing but fruits and vegetables (the easiest and lowest energy expended to digest), and monitoring her Vitamin D and B-12 levels (very important, especially for older individuals with past health problems); and she has not seen any improvement in her over all well being, then perhaps she needs to give her body the opportunity to heal naturally (fasting).
When you fast for extended periods of time, you are not, as you say, just "foregoing a whopping 75,000 calories all in one lump sum". Just like almost all animals in the wild, the human animal's body has the ability to enter into a fasting state. This fasting state occurs after roughly 3 days of not forcing the body to utilize the majority of its energy to digest and assimilate food matter. Once in this fasting state, we can assume that if the body is not utilizing the estimated 60% of it's energy in digesting (60% for fruit matter, denser matters can utilize up to 80% or more), then that energy will be utilized toward healing ailments in the body that disrupt homeostasis (what the body is always trying to achieve).
So, in conclusion, if Kate has been eating and living as healthy as she possibly can while monitoring her B-12 and Vitamin D levels consistently; and no major changes have been made to her over all well being; and knowing that there is no other options of fueling the body that are better than fruits and vegetables: then the only other option available of naturally healing an underlying ailment is to fast. Conventional medicine will not help her, medication or surgery will only band-aid problems while causing more (like depleted b-12 reserves), and conventional doctors will disagree with her current dietary life choices. At her age, with 35 years of internal damage due to dietary decisions and intake of toxic chemicals; you must be very careful with what you choose to do next in regards to your health.
It may not be as simple for her as say: subtracting one banana per day (100 calories) from her diet. If she hasn't lost any weight in 3 years, I highly doubt taking one banana out of her diet per day will drop the weight.
Kate, if you do not check your B-12 and D levels regularly and your B-12 reserves are low; start up a B-12 shot regimen to get your levels up to par and make sure your D is perfect. Do this while continuing to eat and regularly exercise. If you do not see changes after several months with a consistently perfect B-12 and D level, then perhaps think about fasting. Yes, fasting at Doug's retreat can be expensive. But what is cost if it means your health? If an underlying health issue cannot be fixed through conventional means or with the best and only way to fuel your body, then you may end up spending more money in the long run if an underlying health issue is left unhealed. Even if you have to borrow money, take out a loan, sell your car, sell everything you don't need for survival (furniture, unused clothing, jewelery, etc); it will be worth it in the long run if it means fixing any underlying health problem that could develop into permanent damage.
If I am missing something, are completely incorrect, out of line, or if you have any other suggestions to helping her; then please add to this discussion. I am just adding input from what I believe is the most logical course of action.
After realizing these apparent facts that relate to Kate's situation and understanding that the majority of individuals (healthy or unhealthy) who integrate the 80/10/10 lifestyle; combined with consistent exercise, consistent water uptake, consistent sleep, consistent lowered stress levels, and vitamin D and B-12 check ups and replenishment: We can only assume that Kate may have an underlying health problem that will not be fixed no matter what food she eats or how frequently she moves her blood
Well, I don't think we can "only assume" that she may have an underlying health problem, but I appreciate your explaining where you are coming from. Peace.
Yes, I agree. Assuming is pointless considering that we aren't Kate's body and there is only so much that can be known given the small amount of details that we are given through the medium of an internet discussion board. My assumptions have only been made by what I believe could be the logical explanation to helping fix her issue.
However, one thing is for certain: Whether or not you; forever have 35% fat on your frame; cannot lose what you consider is additional fat; cannot feel good eating a certain way (regardless of what that way is); cannot heal anything you deem as a bodily problem: There is only one way to properly place matter into our bodies internal fuel processing mechanism, and that's to put fruit and vegetable matter into it.
If you live your life carrying the same overweight frame whilst eating fruits and vegetables, there is no point in being disappointed in the fruits and vegetables dietary regimen. Fruits and vegetables are proven to be the best for your body and the best for the Earth and the health of the Earth is bigger than all human egos combined. In my opinion, it is better to 'suffer' whilst helping to reverse the overall problem that the human species have caused through the agricultural revolution, then 'suffer' whilst adding more to the problem.
The exact chemistry that occurs in each individual body is a process that may be beyond what we've come to observe and figure out through clinical observation or mathematics. In the miniscule time that we walk across this planet in these fleshy vessels, some things may be left unknown. But one thing that is known; fruits and vegetables will, in time, repair the damage that the agricultural revolution has caused.
I wish Kate luck in remedying the issues that she has run into and I hope that she can find happiness in at least knowing that her dietary choices are the right choices when it comes to helping save this planet from the pain that it does not deserve; regardless of how much these right choices will impact her internally.
Interesting points Universal Mind, you got me thinking I should get checked again after a year since. Last time only my sodium was low, don't know what that was about, and I was not given the correct test for B12. She was so negative about my being vegan (didn't tell her raw!) I was not inclined to visit again.
I use B12 drops and a VitD lamp, plus allowing myself extra sleep makes a vast difference. btw, it's 50 years dietary abuse; prior to age 15 I ate standard-uk, after that a dairy-free version of the same. I only went vegan 3 years back.
In truth, I have just begun consults with Dr D; the fasting with him has appealed to me for a long time, but consultations were the best I could do.
Thank you for your thorough and detailed answer.
I would really recommend reading the book Could It Be B-12? You can find it on Amazon for less than $6. The book is not only an eye opening read, but it also tells you what you need to instruct medical professionals on what exactly to test (as there are different types of B-12 tests, and the blood test can sometimes not reveal a true deficiency).
Unless I'm wrong with this, I have not read anywhere that B-12 drops or other B-12 related supplements (other than the shot), will raise a seriously low B-12 deficiency. By seriously low, I mean below the 600 level.
Your drops may have helped maintain your level, but your level could have been low or borderline low to begin with. You may be surprised at the difference you will feel if you discover your level is low and get on a shot regimen to fix that problem.
At your age, I would recommend having your B-12 and D levels checked every 6 months, even if your levels are fine from the initial check. Also at older age, the Vitamin D and B-12 factor can be a life changer if they are to drop too low.
Also, another suggestion, find a doctor of naturopathic medicine over a conventional doctor. Not only are they able to do the same vitamin D and B-12 checks (make sure you get both the urinary B-12 and blood B-12 tests, the book "Could It Be B-12?" explains further), but they will be much more supportive of your lifestyle.
With 50 years of abuse and no real, recent, B-12 and vitamin D analysis, I would seriously recommend getting these done as soon as you can. You may be surprised at what you find. Also, if you do not want to buy the $6 book, "Could It Be B-12?", I've found it at several public libraries and it may be at one near you. It's really a book that cannot be missed.
Thanks again, will get the book. I was not aware that drops could be insufficient. It is true that of the posts I have seen here, no-one really claims energy increase from oral supplementation; shots seem to get rave reviews however.
I know this post was a couple months ago, but I can't help but laugh. What the heck do you think 100 less calories a day will do? I would suggest 1000 MORE. 2500 a day, working out 2 hours a day every day? She needs at least 3500 calories. Of course she's not losing fat, her body thinks it's starving.
Very helpful post ! Thank you !
Thanks for this...and to everyone's replies on my other comment (as a reply to http://www.30bananasaday.com/forum/topics/i-ve-gained-20lbs-i-can-t...).
I am sure that I'm still not eating enough, as I often go to bed hungry. But I get tired of eating and can't fit anymore into my body! Because of this, I really haven't gotten enough sleep over the past year or so. (however, for about the past 2 months, I've been sleeping great for the most part!) And coming from a background of digestive disease and adrenal exhaustion, yes, I know I have a lot of healing to do. (I was told in the mid-90's I'd probably NEVER fully recover. If I'd only known about 80/10/10 then!) Even though I made a lot of mistakes along the way, starting to try to figure things out myself when the Internet was barely going yet, I feel that I have been on a healing path for many years, so put into perspective the frustration that I feel that I'm not seeing results yet in terms of lowering my body fat percentage. Undereating - not as an eating disorder or because I was dieting - but genuinely not knowing HOW to eat enough/how to get enough food in the house or plan ahead when socializing - for really many years, is not going to be forgiven by my body very quickly. But there is a perfectionist inside me that says "hey, I'm finally doing everything right - where are the results?"
When I look at the list above, I see that I don't get enough sunlight part of the year (I may make up for it when I do get enough, though). And when I don't eat enough, I also don't sleep enough (but not because I didn't try!) I've made lots of progress and feel that all of the other areas are coming along pretty well. I don't know how many calories I burn through activity (and frankly, don't really care), but I'm sweating buckets, so I feel that the time, intensity, and frequency are there.
Also, I'm just glad to know that I'm not the only one who's been doing this awhile (however imperfectly) and still holding on to unwanted inches. I'm going to go to the thrift store and pick up some comfortable clothes. And if they only fit a few weeks, I guess I need to stop being cheap and take care of my appearance at least partly as well as I'm trying to take care of the rest.
I eat cooked food rather than under-eating. I have extra weight to lose but it's feeling good to let go of my thoughts on that and enjoy my exercise and my life and helping others. And it feels good to sleep deeply. Eventually I will increase my income and access to good quality fruit, and be fully raw and fully healed.
I have noticed a huge difference taking Vitamin D in the winter. Depending how far north you are, you probably cannot make up for it in the other months even if you were outside all day. You could get tested to confirm that. There is a vegan d3 supplement available now.
Have fun getting some clothes. HUGS!
True Michele, taking care of our appearance is a big confidence boost for us gals. It also inspires us to look after ourselves well generally, to feel we are worth it :).
It does read like you are not eating enough if you go to bed hungry.
But your major medical concerns improving has to be your primary focus. I too started with the diet from dissatisfaction with health, tho nothing medically diagnosed. Whatever you do, focus on healing over inch loss. Best wishes for success! xx
For example, today, I've had 4000+ calories of dates, bananas, mangos, celery and other greens. I am stuffed, but I suspect that feeling in the back of my throat is telling me I probably needed more. That's what I mean when I am sometimes going to bed hungry. I just can't fit anymore food in, though.