30 Bananas a Day!

Hello. I am new to this HCLF lifestyle. I have been using the website Cronometer to track calories from carbs. I am 122 pounds, and I am 5 foot 1. I do not exercise. 

Cronometer says I should consume no more than 1269 calories daily. 

I wish to lose weight on this lifestyle. Cronometer says I should have a calorie deficit of 499 to lose a pound a week. 

My problem is I found myself sickly tired. My body seems to want me to sleep more than eat. Maybe it's healing? Detox? Starvation? google says it's blood sugar spike from fruit. idk.. 

How much should I eat? Should I listen to Cronometer? 

Help is much appreciated. ty!  

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Welcome to 30BaD Sarah! :)

Under eating causes low energy, low mood and a craving for high fat and highly processed foods.  It also tends to throw off your metabolism.  Sugar spikes are generally caused by eating too high fat.  You can see this reverse when people with type 2 diabetes change to low fat.  The film 'What The Heath' addresses this sugar spike issue beautifully. You can get the film at your library through the inter-library loan system. Bringing the film home is a great way to share this info with your friends and family too! :)

Aloha to 30BaD's Welcome Wagon! has more info. that can help you get started in losing weight in a sustainable way that also gives you a happy mood and lots of energy.  Cutting the fat down to around 10% of calories or less is the key to losing weight.

My fat and protein is 10%. Carbs are around 80%. I don't see the answer to my question, but I appreciate the response.

If you read through the welcome wagon you will see explained that 2500 calories is a good minimum for ladies and why. :)

It is normal to feel 'sick' when you are eating less than meets your desires. From my experience and from what I've read; your body requires of you to rest and endure boredom/lethargy/fasting while it heals itself. By far the best book I've ever read is: http://www.truthseekerz.com/Arnold_Mucusless_Diet.pdf . He experiments diets/fasting etc and provides his results and experience. The really useful empirical data from all this is that at first while fasting he started feeling dizzy and weak, but persevered through it and found out that when your body makes 'eliminations'/detoxes, it rarely is pleasant. Without such experiences a person would rationally assume that the lethargy and weakness is detrimental to their health. Ehret proves otherwise.

The symptom of your body healing itself is often flu/cold-like. Though unpleasant, your body healing itself is what you seek. I recommend reading Ehret's book in case you ever feel compelled to fast. However, I highly recommend intermittent fasting or drinking juice at first. From my experience fruits increase the unpleasant/potent symptoms of detox and vegetables/fiber lessen them. Use vegetables specifically leafy greens to maintain a comfortable detox.

I highly regard Ehret because he provides you with information that you might not get yourself because it is rational to stop something that makes you feel weak. If you look at the majority you can see failures in terms of dietary results and so if you want considerable change you must change your habits considerably. You can also check this playlist out for a slightly different/potent approach https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qD966PN531s&list=PLIWo2dGh9fzly.... But Ehret's book is really good so that you can understand what you will be going through and why (so you don't waver). All of us have been raised to overeat the wrong food. I personally don't think that people should decay/deteriorate so much with age, they're just reaping what they sowed as a result of their habits.

Initially eat as much as you want of the right food (fruit/ leafy greens) [ I personally think dark leafy greens like kale digest better if you slightly heat them, but I prefer to stick to lettuce etc]. If you don't exercise, skipping out on breakfast and not breaking your over night fast/elimination/detox is the best way to go. I think that while you detox, you shouldn't focus too much on nutrition because most people suffer from malabsorption and so first focus on detox. Let your body heal itself and it will as long as it doesn't focus all its energy on inefficiently digesting and eliminating the wrong foods.

Avoid starchy vegetables as much as possible, if you do eat them be sure to eat a lot of leafy greens along with them.

Fraternally, wishing all the best,

With regards to the John Rose playlist, skip until you see him talking. I just searched John Rose juicing playlist, the first couple of videos without him don't have too much substance.

Yes this all makes sense & sounds exactly like what I'm going through. It is the end of week 1 now, I fought through the flu like tiredness, I feel less tired now, even tho I sleep like a baby :) I have been fasting a bit through this, usually i fast before sleep but ill try fasting instead of breakfast. I just know i wont give up. thanks so much for the help. Ill check out the playlist

It warms my heart to hear how much effort you are putting in and hope that you get the results you deserve! If you get hungry in the morning just drink some fresh fruit juice if you can to stall your hunger if for at least a little bit (it will also serve you in detoxing). The important difference to note between Rose and Ehret is that Rose buys more into modern science and advocates protein/supplements and Ehret's view is purely empirical and against it. Just wanted to add that b/c I'm at odds when it comes to modern science.



>If you get hungry in the morning just drink some fresh fruit juice if you can to stall your hunger if for at least a little bit (it will also serve you in detoxing).

This advice may lead to under eating and 30BaD promotes eating at least 2500 minimum calories for ladies and more if you are active. The hows and why are answered here: Aloha to 30BaD's Welcome Wagon!

A.  How do i know im not eating enough calories from fruit?
1. Other food starts to look and smell good.
2. Cooked food looks more then the second rate option it really is.
3. Your energy, power, strength start to go downhill.
4. Your attitude starts to suck. You just want to rip apart people and scream at them with frustration.
5. You start to question this whole raw gig.
6. You get cravings during the day and evening.
7. You start to rely on discipline to keep you raw.
8. You start to make raw pasta dishes, raw cakes etc.
9. You start to question if we really need to exercise.
10. Your so thin and weak that your athletic friends start to get concerned.
11. You start to question veganism.
12. You start blending maccadamias with dulse and spread it on 1inch thick flax crackers you made at 3am in the morning.
13. You wake up at night and steal your housemates fruit. If your housemate is called banana guns and he told you not to eat the papaya, and you did, you aint eating enough fruit cals.
14. You start to want to take fancy herbs and experiement with other diets.
15. Your actually eating pizza and reading this.
16. Youve got some Fred Bisci Enzymes in your pocket and your ready to try the 'all raw but 20% cooked rule'
17. You want to believe that Brian Clement is right when he says corn chips are better than fruit. 
18. You just paid aajonus vonderplanitz 400$ for a one hour consult and he told you to put an egg on a window edge for 50 days until its putrid and then to eat it. and you did it. you saw your dog eat some animal poo and you tried it too. ( true story i just heard).
19. You just cant sleep!! you are approaching insomniac.


Ednshell I agree with what you're saying, let me clarify my thoughts.

I am advocating undereating/fasting, mild implementations at first (intermittent).  At first I personally just let my fat and protein intake diverge >>>0 to allow my body to heal without dealing with digestion for too long. This however will make you feel really weak and as you state you will have to rely on discipline.

It is necessary to put up with boredom/lethargy while not being stimulated/filled/having your body preoccupied with digestion. As you fast you lack energy yet you cannot sleep because you are used to  putting yourself to sleep by tiring yourself out. Just as your parents taught you to as a kid. Shame on you, you kept them up by being energetic, but you seek to attain that vigor of youth now. If you fill yourself up to force yourself to sleep, you will just be negating the advantages of a raw vegan diet.

Fat/protein/stimulants will stimulate you and make you feel energetic while shutting your annoying stomach up! However, we want to let our body do its work in peace. Fasts are a bit spiritual, you give up your desires/body and see results as you do work internally. You are stimulated not by the body and instead by the mind.

I personally have always been lean and did not know I was a glutton until I  recently started paying for it in my mid 20s, which made me converge to a raw vegan. Working out slowly started to age me because it was no substitute for a clean diet.

You guys can take any approach you like, I just found it especially opportune to suggest fasting when Sarah noted that she doesn't exercise. While raw salads/fruits are amazing. Without adding a ton of protein/fat into your salad and consuming a ton of fruit calories, without working out, you will not be sated nor be quick to see results, and might be deterred by weight gain. That is why I suggest not going for the fullfillment offered by filling your belly, but by sacrificing that fullfillment for a short while and letting your tastes acclimate. 

Give up your pleasure at first and you will end up having more pleasure from the right food. I am suggesting that feeling like crap and being weak might lead you to desired results. Men especially find it hard to fast because they short shortsightedly compete with protein junkies/steroid/hormone users. However those 'cheaters' tend to lose most of that 'muscle mass', end up with half the skeletal mass, and die middle aged. Personally I believe that both protein and fat make a person more plump as it gets stored up in the body and the person will be able to use that 'muscle mass' (which I look as fat) to lift more. I mean from my point of view, if you work out and earn your muscles, it is not logical for them to deteriorate and for the body to work against you. Your body was just detoxing and unfortunately the fat/protein ended up detrimental.

I studied physics and learned that modern science is a bunch of wiseacring. I suggest not heeding modern science/medicine for much except for ideas you can ponder and keep in mind to guide you to more precise/true concepts. My views are contrary to most and I might end up offending some of you, if that offense will stimulate thought ( to prove me wrong ) so be it! From my point of view proteins etc are just as made up as particles; to offer proof for desired outcomes.

Proteins are pushed pretty hard and if you are a vegan you will probably end up getting asked where do you get your protein? Even though no one even knows what it is and no one has ever suffered from its deficiency. It is by incentives like protein or prices that the people are stimulated when choosing what to buy in a market. Fruits grow in abundance and easily and don't have to be fed and catered to or slaughtered like animals. Yet fruits are the more expensive and offer no protein while animals do. One thing is certain, you can die from many deficiencies and go on many diets, but definitely will not last very long if you go on a high fat high protein diet. "Moderation is always key" has always conveniently protected indulgence for addicts/hedonists.

Fruits are from my point of view the ideal food. Even primates who are closest to humans are fruitivores (when left alone). Fruits also digest the quickest, which is the primary guideline when searching for a species specific diet. The deficiency of fruit stems from it digesting so quickly. People are programmed to fill up their bellies and indulge in gluttony. And fruits just won't let you satisfy your fat/protein addiction that probably stemmed from eating meat. You must first go through discipline and fasting ( I consider lack of protein/fat a fast ).

Meanwhile leafy greens are great, but are usually smeared in dressing/protein/fat to be made palatable, which makes them not so ideal. They are great for those transitioning away from cooked food because an unhealthy person will both be burned by the sun and killed by the ideal food (fruit) for being purely toxic themselves. Rushing fruit solely is just as dangerous as rushing a prolonged fast, but the ideal diet in the end is fruitarian and the ideal method of healing is fasting.

Best wishes,


>The really useful empirical data from all this is that at first while fasting he started feeling dizzy and weak, but persevered through it and found out that when your body makes 'eliminations'/detoxes, it rarely is pleasant.

This is good advice for water fasting for sure but does not apply to Sarah's under eating situation here.  When eating a raw diet and feeling sickly tired you can be 99% sure that it's from under eating not detox as is commonly thought. Switching to low fat vegan and and/or raw will bring one's energy up not down provided you are eating enough.  You can learn more here on these topics and 30BaD's guidelines on them: Aloha to 30BaD's Welcome Wagon! and Forum Guidelines: Read before posting!

>I personally think dark leafy greens like kale digest better if you slightly heat them, but I prefer to stick to lettuce etc]

I agree.  30BaD's welcome wagon has some good info on greens...

Benefits of Lettuce Greens

Do I need to eat greens?

What kind of greens and how much?

Why do I need to eat lettuce greens?


Oxalate Health Impact

What are oxalates and oxalic acid?

How can oxalates harm us?

What foods are high in oxalates?


This is a helpful list of greens to not eat raw and why:


Cruciferous Vegetables

Brussels sprouts
Bok choy (greens)
Collard greens

All are disqualified as optimal or even appropriate due to high cellulose content. Our bodies have limited ability to access the nutrients encased in the cellulose structure, so most of what we eat of them must only be eliminated from the body, which unnecessarily taxes our eliminative processes. These vegetables also contain irritating and indigestible oxalic acid and are bland or unpleasant to eat in their raw state. The exception in this category is young or baby spinach, which has what most people describe as a pleasant flavor and is relatively easy to digest in moderate quantities since its oxalic acid content is low at this point in its growth.

I will be honest. I do feel like I rely on discipline to continue this lifestyle. Truly, I am under eating because i feel like I am force feeding myself, force feeding foods im not used to and whole plates of it. Yeah i can tolerate the whole wheat pastas, the plain boring baked potatoes, plates of fruit in the morning, it doesnt taste bad at all but it certainly is not pleasurable. I know raw recipes, and eating more it, could solve this problem, but It's just too expensive for me, im limted to 40 US dollars a week, maybe 50, I cant afford good tasting raw recipes. & the under eating makes me tired which makes me feel like I might as well not eat. All through out today i'm just thinking about junk food, and french fries. It makes me want to binge. Part of me just wants to quit this lifestyle, and be a junk food vegan. 

My suggestion is, try a pro longed fast once you have the time and if possible find someone to supervise you. Hopefully someone will supervise you for free, but even if not you will be saving on food expenses, ca ching ca ching!

The fact that you already have incentives to eat less should make fasting a bit more tolerable. Even athletes use intermittent fasting for muscle retention, but pure pro longed fasts offer way faster results. You can consider using enemas as well. If you have a budget issue juicing might not be ideal, maybe eating cheap fruits like oranges and spitting any fiber that gets in your way or just eating fast digesting foods like melons can provide you with an alternative.  Fasting is most potent if you do nothing but lay down in fresh air/by an open window. If you can completely endure the boredom and don't look for things to keep yourself entertained, you will optimize the results of your fast. Those that tell you that you don't require discipline to transition to a raw vegan diet from junk foods have never completed the transition themselves. I just hope everything works out and that you don't end up reverting to junk. If you ever feel like you must eat junk food, eat a ton of salad with it. According to Ehret, leafy greens are good because of their rough texture and that they tend to broom your intestines as they are being digested. I hope this suggestion doesn't spur you to start eating junk, I'm just hoping to provide with more healthy alternatives. Leafy greens are also pretty inexpensive. With supervision your fast will probably end up lasting longer so that you don't waver by letting yourself ponder if you can tolerate it any further.  Just know that as many weeks as it takes to fast, it might take that many years of intermittent fasting/raw vegan diet to provide equal results. Raw vegan diet is good because it is digested quickly, however nothing compares to not introducing any work. Which is why I was advocating juice fasting at first. 

Lastly, when you want to end your fast, consider juicing tomatoes (with or w/o salt) or fruits to prolong your fast with a juice fast in the end while helping yourself transition back to solid food by introducing some 'work' for your body. I personally juice key limes or regular limes with ( sweet) apples really frequently, they're pretty cheap and really tasty/ potent.

I really hope everything works out,




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