Pros and Cons of Fasting with Loren Lockman

Pros

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1. The grounds were beautiful

2. Loren knows about fasting

3. The people I met were very nice and the vibe was good.

4. The lectures were helpful

5. Loren helped with me with my detox

6. The weather was nice most of the time 80f sunny and raining sometimes.

7. The housekeepers were of good service

8. The views were fantastic

9. The natural beauty was spectaclar

10. The air was very clean and amazing

11. It was very affordable

12. The water was pure and excellent

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Cons

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1. The place was dated

2. The sheets and comforters were stained

3. The staff was treated poorly

4. Loren told me that he had no wi fi when in fact he did and he said it caused cancer

5. I paid for the ride to and from the airport and thought it would be included

6. Loren talked badly about other health leaders and said he knew for a fact about personal things about them and I found them not to be true.

7. The beds were too hard

8. The walls were paper thin and you could hear every word your neighbors would say

9. Internet was very expensive, he charges per minute 10 cents which I thought was crazy

10. Lights out at 8:30 pm on the grounds

11. The weight scale was dated and was not really accurate for reading fat and hydration

12. The Library had no books on health and had old novels and old magazines and was small with a small selection.

13. Loren told us all about his financial problems and I found it to be unprofessional

14. I felt as though I was getting Island Fever and felt trapped at times.

15. The fruit after re feeding was not ripe and not very tasty

16 Not every room had warm showers

17. Mosquitoes, spiders, scorpions, snakes were on the grounds and Gekos that were very noisey at night

18. A lot of outside noise from the neighbors at times and dogs barking in the middle of the night. Bring your earplugs!

I hope that one day these corrections will be made by Loren So things will be more comfortable in the future.

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Permalink Reply by Francesca on April 8, 2012 at 6:17am

Oh my goodness. I read the story about the college student who wasn't refunded her money. Yikes!

So my senses didn't fail me about him. In the class we had really interesting discussions, and the information was beneficial to me. But actually, I did sense something dark, strange about him, as nice as he was. I often thought he was flirting with me (and I'm 22).

It is so nice to have you all in this community to share your experiences and stories. I was considering interning for him down there, but that is no longer an option for me.

Cia, I'm so sorry you had to endure that and have your money stolen!

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Permalink Reply by April Smiles on April 8, 2012 at 10:40am

He was most definitely flirting with you. He flirts with anyone and everyone under 35 (who is thin; he also made it clear he only dates "in shape" women). He would frequently tell us that he had to date younger because "women his age can't keep up with him." I would just think 'give me break.' I was down there two months (doing the "internship," which wasn't one by the way) and he wasn't all that active or stimulating.

I agree. It's so nice to have this rant room and get some of this off my chest (and hopefully warn others at the same time)!

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Permalink Reply by Francesca on April 8, 2012 at 11:31am

Yep. That would be me. You know when you feel the flirty vibe? I felt it hard core.

You did an internship with him! Well you are most definitely a primary source here. Were there any benefits for you, doing this internship?

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Permalink Reply by Cia on April 9, 2012 at 5:24am

I ALMOST did the internship but I was throwing up bile on days 12, 13, 14 as my roommate was crawling to the bathroom having diarrhea. it was so disgusting. I had to get Loren in the middle of the night as I was so worried about myself and my roommate. Both of us were so dehydrated. I stopped after 14 days as I knew this had now reached an unhealthy point. I had fasted 17 days in the past. Anyway, since I did not complete the 21 day fast, Loren was very nasty to me and would not let me do the internship..this was such a blessing..I could not wait to get out of there and the ones that stayed, I can put you in touch with as they said that it was very flawed. Also, the first time I fasted, another intern left as she had a major problem with him and you could actually hear them fighting. Not fun to hear on your 3rd day at a retreat, fasting for the first time. 2 interns that I have talked too were very deficient in minerals from following his diet and one girl actually passed out for months after she left the Internship. If you go, just get an open ended ticket incase you have to leave early. I have always done that when I went there..but also, he no longer has Tanglewood so I have no idea what his set is at his new place is, but I would find a more reputable place to go to. A person that has to keep moving from place to place should be a red flag to anyone..if you read some info on the internet, there are reasons he left MD, and he did not leave Panama willingly, he had too! BIG RED FLAG..and as far as ever being in a relationship with him, I can't even imagine. The thought is repulsive. The woman would have to be young because a strong mature woman would not put up with his BS for a minute..

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Permalink Reply by April Smiles on April 13, 2012 at 4:10pm

Hi, Francesca! I too felt like he was (very slightly) flirty with me at first (but actually I wasn't sure if he was gay or not so I was just confused) but the moment I asked really just a clarifying question about something he said all that turned and he quit being slightly suggestive, for the most part.

Yes, I did the "internship" with Loren. I put internship in quotes because my internship with Loren entailed... doing absolutely nothing. I fixed their computers a couple times because the internet kept going out (because he was too cheap to buy a new ethernet cord so we had to 'jimmy' it with a rubber band, but I digress). Other than that, I just began eating with him and another lady who was on a work trade in the back of the place instead of where the re-feeding for fasters occurs. I signed to do the internship because I had wanted to obviously live on fruit longer (which was unripe and not even organic half the time... never been so unhappy with my fruit!) and I thought I would learn how to run the business, take care of the grounds, assist with fasters or whatever... absolutely nothing. Like Cia though, by the time (or rather, way before) it came around for me to do the internship I was absolutely dreading it because I wanted to spend as little time with him as possible and didn't have the money to change my ticket/plans. I made some offers to him on a few occasions to see what I could contribute or helpt with (because he didn't even mention anything when I was in the 'internship' phase) but I didn't push it too hard. He promised a lot of things when I was on the phone with him before arriving but very little was based on truth, although there are elements of truth in whatever he says. He doesn't out and out lie (usually) so much as make the truth "flexible" which is what makes him so deceptive and tricky to nail down. He basically figures out what you want to hear and promises you it all.

I was told by previous fasters who did the internship that they essentially had to do book reports for him. They also said it was very draining and taxing having just come off 21-32 day fasts (which I can't even imagine having to do) and felt they really needed a lot of rest, which I completely agree with. Loren seems to really lack understanding of recovery after a fast (which he doesn't prepare fasters for adequately at all in my opinion and I think is so dangerous) and it's especially surprising given how much he claims to fast. Maybe the difference is he said the longest fast he'd done in awhile if I a remembering correctly is two weeks which is hugely different physiologically from 3-4. One thing is for sure, you are NOT ready and back to get up and go after 7 days like he says and there ARE side effects to fasting this long. It took me a good month or more (much more actually) to feel back to 100% and these other fasters all shared that opinion.

I could list a lot more about the experience but I try to keep these posts less than a page long! ; ) I could write as much or more than Victoria - and with different things to say, too!

I too had to listen to Loren fighting with and yelling at other fasters, calling them idiots, stubborn, absurd and a litany of other things...

SO TRUE, CIA: A person that has to keep moving from place to place should be a red flag to anyone!

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Permalink Reply by Cia on April 14, 2012 at 12:40am

The earrings don't help with having to 2nd guess the sexuality..interesting what you say about the half truths as I saw this quote on Facebook yesterday. "Never forget that a half truth is a whole lie". It it made me think of Loren. I was tempted to post it on the "Friends of natural Hygiene" group on FB where I posted my ripoff report which someone that is part of the group suggested that I did. It caused quite a stir. Instead of Loren addressing the issue and acknowledging the fact that he had stolen my $ and forced the college student to have to drop out of school, all he talks about is his hardships, how he helps so many others, and how smart he thinks he is..I was really embarrassed for him for this posting. There is nothing more of a turn off than someone tooting their own horn. Truly accomplished people do not have to do this as their actions speak for them self. This one woman mentioned that she was still going to go to his retreat. At first I was going to comment but then I have to remember that I too was a fan of his as my first fasting experience was very positive. My first impression of him was good to, so I do understand where these people are coming from. At the time I went, there was a woman named Ruth that was basically running the show. She was smart, attractive, and very nurturing and really added to the environment. Unfortunately, she quit and of course not a amicable parting. But if you have a brief encounter with him, and agree with him, and do not get ripped off by him, or verbally accosted, I can see how he can come across very likable. Unfortunately, that was not the case with me. It has been a real lesson. If I were to go t a retreat again, I would not go to one that has good and bad reviews as to me that is like a 50/50 chance of it going one way or another and not a risk I would take again with such a high cost involved. I did look at other places and told Loren, and he shot down each and every one of them telling me all the cons and why his was the best and again I fell for it but mainly I liked the fact that I knew what to expect and I did think it was pretty but the place is gone now and I am out over $2400! I have talked to law enforcement so even if I do not get my $ back, they are helping me with trying to make sure this does not happen to anyone else. Very well written rip off report!!

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Permalink Reply by April Smiles on April 8, 2012 at 10:49am

Completely agree that at first he comes across as well intentioned and even intelligent at times, but then the more you listen to him the more you see he's just memorized a few things and is unable to work with the ideas intelligently in debate/conversation.

In regards to "The Mask of Sanity" I mentioned above regarding non-violent psychopaths, here is some of the information I felt really struck a cord for Loren:

Superficial charm and good intelligence
Absence of delusions and other signs of irrational thinking (no obvious delusions)
Absence of nervousness or psychoneurotic manifestations
Unreliability
Untruthfulness and insincerity
Lack of remorse and shame
Inadequately motivated antisocial behavior
Poor judgment and failure to learn by experience (he's been hearing the same things from people for over 15 years!)
Pathologic egocentricity and incapacity for love
General poverty in major affective reactions
Specific loss of insight (he doesn't seem to learn anything..)
Unresponsiveness in general interpersonal relations
Fantastic and uninviting behavior with drink and sometimes without (not sure this one applies)
Suicide threats rarely carried out (I don't think this one applies either)
Sex life impersonal, trivial, and poorly integrated
Failure to follow any life plan.

Doesn't he fit most of those?!? Also..

The psychopath very seldom takes much advantage of what he gains and almost never works consistently toward a goal in crime or anything else, seemingly lacking purpose.
Criminal ends, though condemned, can usually be understood by the average man. It is not hard to understand why a criminal steals money. However, the psychopath, if he steals or defrauds, appears to do so for an obscure purpose, sometimes incomprehensibly throwing away much of value for short-term gains.
The criminal usually spares harm to himself as much as he can and harms others. The psychopath, although he causes sorrow and trouble for others, usually puts himself in a shameful position. His most serious damage to others is often through their concern for him and their futile efforts to help him.
The typical psychopath, from Cleckley's observations, usually avoids murder or other offenses that lead to lengthy prison sentences. The larger part of the psychopath's antisocial behavior can be interpreted as purposely designed to harm himself. Cleckley adds that most of the people who commit violent and serious crimes fail to show the chief characteristics of a psychopath.

I feel that's it exactly. I wouldn't say his intent is necessarily to cause others harm so much as himself. Anyway! Just my dissection of his psychology. : )

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Permalink Reply by Maria Paula Estela on April 10, 2012 at 7:14am

Just wanted to let you know my latest experience with loren lockman. To whom it may concern, this is one of the latest updates on this man and his center. I'm the student cited on this article....and yes I lost my money as well! It's almost 9 months now I've been trying to get a hold of this guy but it wasn't until things were made public that he came up with a bible long email explaining why he was missing with a lot of crap. I wonder why we still do a search on google on his name but none of the bad stuff comes out. We need to inform people about this guy.

If anyone else bought a package for Tanglewood in Panama, not knowing that they had moved or were going to move, please let us know as I would like to talk to you..thanks.

Cynthia Allf - https://www.facebook.com/cynthiaallf
Maria Estela - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=507793929

Read the article posted below.

Loren Lockman Bait & Switched Locations of the retreat and then did not honor the fasting package I had purchased and trade agreement.
http://www.ripoffreport.com/healthcare-centers/loren-lockman/loren-...

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Permalink Reply by Maria Paula Estela on April 10, 2012 at 7:15am

If anyone else bought a package for Tanglewood in Panama, not knowing that they had moved or were going to move, please let us know as I would like to talk to you..thanks.

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Permalink Reply by Cia on April 29, 2012 at 2:45pm

I contacted the police about my situation of Loren taking the money that did not belong to him. They told me to contact the fraud department of Pay Pal since that is how I paid. They did an investigation and I got $900 of the $1200 plus that he owed me. Unfortunately, I paid the rest to him in cash and trade. So the story gets better. A few weeks ago my aol account gets hacked and then today, I get a message from FB saying that someone was trying to access my account from a place that was out of the ordinary..they showed me the location and it was from Costa Rica! Interesting is the fact that I used the same pass code to make a purchase on the Tanglewood website as the ones on both of the accounts that were hacked...hmmmm? Be sooo careful when choosing a fasting retreat as there are some that are posing to be legit that are not!! I also just talked to a girl that fasted 4 times last year and she was anorexic and now her health is really screwed up and metabolism. You have to wonder about a retreat leader that would take someone on that has already fasted 4 times in one year and is anorexic. Makes you wonder if it is about caring for someone's health or if it is about the retreat making money! She is 5' 5" and started the fast at 99 lbs and got down to 75lbs!!