30 Bananas a Day!

How to Determine Whether Your Body Produces INTRINSIC FACTOR to Process B12

It appears to be an evolutionary process in action within our bodies. How fascinating.  Apparently, not everyone is born with the capacity
to make intrinsic factor, the unidentifiable enzyme-like substance
secreted by the stomach that allows people who eat animal products (traditionally considered the only reliable source), as well as vegans (who generally can only get it from unwashed garden vegetables/greens) to receive B12.  But people from a lineage of vegetarians -
like many in India for example - potentially do. Here's what I found:

From: http://www.peoplesrx.com/common/news/store_news.asp?task=store_news...

According to Dr. Jack Tips in his book titled The Pro-Vita! Plan, "This
digestive factor which converts niacin to niacinamide by attaching an
amino acid and synthesizes Vitamin B-12 from amino acids, is inherent in some persons via vegetarian lineage.
It is called the ‘intrinsic factor.‘" Many people do not have this
Intrinsic factor, making it difficult to maintain health on a
vegetarian diet.

Dr. Royal B. Lee, a highly respected nutritional researcher, discovered
a self test to perform in order to determine whether or not one has
enough of this "intrinsic factor". The test is called the "Niacin
Flush". Take 100 to 200 mg. of niacin (not niacinamide), on an empty
stomach. If you experience flushing, then you do not make enough of the
intrinsic factor.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrinsic_factor



Patients experiencing an insufficiency in their intrinsic factor levels cannot benefit from a low dose oral vitamin B-12 supplement,
because it will not absorb through the wall of the small intestine.
(It's a giant molecule). Historically, the deficiency was thought
untreatable before the discovery that it could be managed with regular
injections of vitamin B-12, thus bypassing the digestive tract. More
recently, Swedish researchers discovered that sufficiently large doses
of B-12 can also be absorbed sublingually, and it may be possible to
avoid injectable B-12.
[citation needed] However, as of yet, no
standards have been set for treatment by the sublingual route and
injections of B-12 are the only reliable method of treatment.

Tags: B12, factor, intrinsic, niacin, sublingual

Views: 4783

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Soooooo how are we supposed to absorb B12 from meat and animal products if our body doesn't produce intrinsic factor? You need that to be able to absorb B12. The article is called "The Niacin Flush Test: Determine if you have the Intrinsic Factor needed to be a Healthy Vegeterian!". How could you be a healthy omnivore without intrinsic factor necessary to absorb B12 that the diet is supposedly rich in?

As far as I know everyone experiences niacin flush when they take too much niacin. As far as I know intrinsic factor is not involved in the conversion of niacin to niacinamide. I'd like to know if I was wrong however. Dr. Jack sounds like a quack to me.
What I've heard from the David Wolfe interview with Dr. Mercola is that it has recently been noticed by conventional medicine that even people who eat animal products, including heavy meat-eaters, are *widely* deficient in B12. That led to the discovery that the body needs this semi-enzyme they've named "intrinsic factor" to process the exceptionally large B12 molecule. Otherwise you need it in a form that bypasses the digestive tract - though how that addresses the size issue, I still haven't yet heard. This is the clearest info I could find.
Yes absolutely meat eaters can become deficient in B12 like anyone else. This does not necessarily mean a lack of production of intrinsic factor though, it may mean that B12 levels in animal foods are greatly overestimated, that it perhaps does not survive the cooking process, or that B12 is not bioavailable, as Marieb once pointed out B12 is destroyed in an acidic environment, so the quanitities of gastric HCl needed to digest at least certain animal foods would mean bye-bye to B12. Lack of intrinsic factor does not necessarily suggest a genetic inability to produce it either, insufficiency of its production may be due to damage to the parietal cells. I've heard the alcohol abuse can result in this.

I'm just curious why the article was subtitled "Determine if you have the Intrinsic Factor needed to be a Healthy Vegeterian!" when you'd have equally as difficult a time being a healthy omnivore if you're body didn't produce intrinsic factor. And I'm really skeptical that the niacin flush is at all a reliable way of testing whether you have a genetic inability to produce intrinsic factor. Doctors can do a Schilling test to determine whether you are producing enough intrinsic factor to absorb B12, I'd go with that if you had reason to believe IF was an issue.
I specified "vegetarian" because this is a vegetarian site and it never occured to me to include people who eat animals. Um, isn't that obvious? And I am not sure why you would discount another type of test other than the one you've heard of, really, you're making me giggle, you're so triggered, it seems! There are almost always many ways to get a particular result. That's part of evolution. What's going on? What is bugging you about new info, HERE, of all places?
The title of the article you linked to was "Determine if you have the Intrinsic Factor needed to be a Healthy Vegeterian!". That is what I was referring to. From what I can tell from your post here.


And I am not sure why you would discount another type of test other than the one you've heard of, really, you're making me giggle, you're so triggered, it seems!

I didn't say it's impossible that a niacin flush may be a reliable test for a genetic inability to produce IF, but I'm extremely skeptical. I'm not aware of any connection between niacin to niacinamide conversion and intrinsic factor; nor do I believe that an insufficiency of intrinsic factor production is necessarily caused by genetics in all cases, or in any necessarily. There may be valid reasons for all this, but I don't take anything on faith alone.


There are almost always many ways to get a particular result. That's part of evolution. What's going on? What is bugging you about new info, HERE, of all places?

There's no proof that what he's saying is correct. It's that simple.
And so what you are saying is that there is proof from sources you trust that the Schilling test works and that's why you validate it, because it proves conclusive to you? That may be and if so I'm grateful to you for posting about that option for all of us to look into. I am posting more info than I've seen, and so far haven't seen the Schilling test mentioned in any of the b12 posts I've read so far, which is a topic I've just begun looking into.

I do wonder, however, why an MD who is offering a solution for B12 deficiency, would suggest the niacin test, in public, on the internet? Perhaps it would be worth asking him why he prefers it over the Schilling test. I'll check it out. Thanks ~
And so what you are saying is that there is proof from sources you trust that the Schilling test works and that's why you validate it, because it proves conclusive to you?

It involves as one of the steps taking intrinsic factor orally along with B12 to see if absorption is adequate (assuming it wasn't just taking B12 on its own). If it is then intrinsic factor deficiency is inferred to be the case. I'm not an expert on the test so I can't comment on it's accuracy, but I'd take that over the niacin flush test unless that was shown to be equally if not more accurate. Anyhow read about it and you can decide for yourself:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schilling_test#Stage_2:_vitamin_B12_an...

I do wonder, however, why an MD who is offering a solution for B12 deficiency, would suggest the niacin test, in public, on the internet?

Maybe he's onto something and he's a good guy or maybe he wants to discourage people from becoming vegan because he knows everyone is going to have niacin flush if they try the test. I imagine he is well meaning, but in any case it is fair to ask for proof of whether these things work, a controlled experiment would be helpful. If it really did work I'd like to know.
You're totally entitled to choose a preference, but why disclaim another way just because you've never heard of it? I am not sure where your confidence in the Schilling test comes from, though it may be the most common test. If it's so conclusive then why isn't it well known that meat eaters are largely deficient in B12?

Why don't you try the niacin test and see? Then have the Schilling test and see if it confirms the niacin test. I am going to do just that.

Neither of us has any proof whatsoever other than what we've read. And as the medical field can not possibly provide a definitive solution for an issue it admits it only barely understands, it only makes sense that new procedures will evolve beyond known tests like the Schilling. Hense, the niacin test, for one.

Do you know niacin has had no testing? It seems like it would be a great idea for you to contact Dr. Jack Tips or even Mercola and ask how they have come to their conclusions. I do hope you will do that and post the conversation here, because I am super curious now. Thanks!
You're totally entitled to choose a preference, but why disclaim another way just because you've never heard of it?

because 1) high doses of niacin on an empty stomach are already known to almost certainly cause 'flushing' 2) there's no known association between the conversion of niacin to niacinamide and intrinsic factor 3) even if this test is accurate and low intrinsic factor production was present this does not necessarily due to a genetic inability to produce it.


Why don't you try the niacin test and see? Then have the Schilling test and see if it confirms the niacin test. I am going to do just that.

Taking niacin on an empty stomach isn't going to tell you anything unless you know your B12 levels already. You will almost certainly experience flush, you can't infer from that alone that your body doesn't produce intrinsic factor. If you want to try out what you suggest that's cool, I'd be interested in the results.


Neither of us has any proof whatsoever other than what we've read. And as the medical field can not possibly provide a definitive solution for an issue it admits it only barely understands, it only makes sense that new procedures will evolve beyond known tests like the Schilling. Hense, the niacin test, for one.

All I'll say is I'd be absolutely astonished if the niacin test proved accurate, but I'll stand corrected if proven wrong.

RSS

30BaD search

Loading

Freelee & Durianrider Blogs

         Durianriders Blog

            Freelee's Blog

© 2014   Created by TheBananaGirl.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service