Hello all,
I have a question for you all and I am looking forward to input because I know there are so many people around here at 30bad that are so well educated and experienced in health, natural hygene, raw veganism, etc.
So here it goes...
Is it normal, good, and even natural to eat so much and keep on eating until you're about to burst, just to prevent a cooked food binge? I know myself... coming from a background of anorexia and bulimia, that on this lifestyle, if I do not completely stuff myself until I feel like I am going to be sick, the temptations to eat cooked vegan foods are still out there (not talking about rice or sweet potatoes, talking about soy ice cream and other junk...) I know a lot of people here do not believe there is such a thing as over-eating on fruits, but I have noticed that some people do seem to think this is possible, like Chris Califano, whose views and input around the forums I always find real interesting, being one of them (unless I understood you wrong, Chris).
Durianrider, you often say that emotional eating doesn't exist, and that wanting to binge out on cooked foods just means you didn't get enough carbs... but is it good for someone to eat so much that they feel literally sick in their stomach from eating too much, just to prevent a cooked food binge?
I have been getting better and better on this lifestyle, but over the past year and a half, I have had plenty a set-back, I will do great, make sure I am always surrounded by a SEA of fresh raw fruits and lotttttts of medjool dates, I get my greens in, I exercise, drink filtered water like there is no tomorrow, I sleep as long as I can and without alarmclock (unless I have an early appointment that i can't miss), and go for as much outside time as I can. And still I get times where I just want to buy every single vegan cookie, ice cream and chips item in the store and eat it all alone in my home, DESPITE knowing how awful I will feel physically and mentally the next day(s). It is not like I am eating only 2000 calories and then wonder, gee, why did I just binge on potato chips?
It seems Durianrider and I will never see eye to eye on this, that anorexia and bulimia are psychological disorders and not just a cause of low carb intake, but that is fine, that is not really what this is about anyway.
I would just like to know if it is a good idea to really stuff yourself in order to prevent cooked food binges?
Before you assume that I have an anorexic stomach... this is not the case, I have thankfully been recovered from anorexia for years, from bulimia too, but I still have binge attacks, just not followed by purging any more :) thankfully. I can eat hormonal always eating teen boys under the table, I work in an all men environment and I can eat ALL of them under the table :P (even in cooked foods) I am not overweight, but I am also not underweight, just a healthy 28 year old.
I hope to receive lots of input on this, because I get confused from time to time about mixed messages concerning whether it is normal/good to eat such high amounts of foods, and in my case, eating until I get physically ill just to avoid binging on cooked foods (because if I eat until I can no longer fit anything into my stomach... cooked food no longer looks tempting, because NOTHING looks tempting at that point ;))
What is very interesting to notice in myself is the following change/evolution... the more I learn, and on this lifestyle it is like you never stop learning, the more facts and studies I read, the more lectures from Dr. Graham I watch, the less appealing certain foods have become to me (like oils for example) which does help in the binging department... but still not entirely, sometimes I still feel like just having a dirty disgusting vegan junk bingeweekend.
Tags: anorexia, binge, bulimia, cooked, disorder, eating, raw, vegan
Daniel, NO! I am not bothered, the opposite... I am really in awe of how much time you're putting in to make your point and helping me. You are wonderful!!!
I have to go now though (life is waiting ;)) but I will be back later to reply more thoroughly to everyone!
Again, many thanks.
Permalink Reply by fruitsandnumbers on Dearest Apollonia,
Your words are so kind and beautiful! I'm deeply moved by them since I know how sincere they are. It makes me so happy to know I'm perhaps being able to do something to help you on your journey towards radiance! You're already such a shining star! I'm absolutely sure you'll soon overcome all your difficulties and become the brightest star of the skies!! Seeing you shining is my greatest gift.
Much love,
Daniel <3 <3
Permalink Reply by fruitsandnumbers on Please don't be. You must be a wonderful and caring person.
If you wish we could talk privately about your opinions.
love and affection,
Daniel <3 <3 <3 :) :) :)
Permalink Reply by Loane on Kimberly,
I agree with you.
I have had anorexia and bulimia too, so I know what it is. People who haven´t been there can not understand apparently.
Eating for us is not about eating because our body needs nutrients. It is much more complicated than that! Like Kimberly said, we could eat until our stomach LITERALLY burst open, because it is NEVER enough. Even if you are throwing up because your stomach is too full you "NEED TO" continue to eat. In bulimia, there is no such thing as "I have eaten enough". So, yes it is dangerous and also, but maybe I am wrong about that, I don´t know how giving to your body constant digestive work (constant because a bulimic person could eat ALL THE TIME) can be good.
I know that people here don´t like to hear that there is such thing as emotional eating, but for having had ED myself, I can tell, that´s not true!
Other example. When a person loves an other person, she could "eat" him/ her. We want that person inside or with us all the time. Does it mean our body needs his/ her flesh? Of course not.
Don ´t you think that addiction to love/sex can be related to food addiction?
Loane,
Thanks for coming in here and sharing your perspective too! it is good to see a lot of people who have suffered from anorexia and bulimia (and other eating disorders) have made it to here... i feel this lifestyle is a really good place to be, and it can help us in our healing :)
love to you xx
Permalink Reply by DURIANRIDER on Ive never seen a bulimic fruit eater long term! That speaks VOLUMES! :)
No such thing as emotional eating. Just people eating the wrong stuff from not eating enough of the right stuff and getting enough sleep and water so their body can get the glucose and nutrients it needs.
Where are the mosquitos with eating disorders? Where are the wild animals with eating disorders? Where is the fruit bat that vomits up a tray of mangoes after 5 years on this lifestyle? lol!
Yeah you got confused newbies like Matt Monarch that vomit some persimmons into a bin but when your an educated and experienced person, your behaviour just shifts to something more empowering vs being a victim.
'I cant change for the better cos I had xyz when I was younger. Yeah it was all in my mind but I just cant change cos that means I lose part of my identity and Im too undercarbed, dehydrated & underslept to forge a new identity based on self love vs self loathe'.
Its just a choice in the moment to feel absolutely amazing. Certain lifestyle habits make this even easier to experience.
Permalink Reply by fruitsandnumbers on Apollonia,
please listen to Harley's words; try to capture their full significance; try to extract the wisdom from them. They're like the sweetest fruit filled with the sweetest wisdom juice.
Quit the victim mentality!! Stop thinking you got mental problems you can't deal with!! You're so strong and wise, Apollonia!! You've already gone so far and overcome so many obstacles! I'm absolutely sure you can defeat your problems! You are far greater than them!!
The power is within you to become whatever you want to become! And we're all here to help! You're not alone; we're all with you in this, sharing all your pains. You can always count on us at your side.
Have courage! That's all you need. You got strength in yourself and support from all of us.
I deeply love you and care for you, Apollonia.
And Harley, thanks for existing, mate. You make me live so fully and blissfully!! I don't know what I'd do without you.
luv <3
Permalink Reply by Greenmama on Where are the mosquitos with a prefrontal cortex? Where are the horses that paint landscape paintings and the pigs that compose symphonies. These animals don't even think to question their diet. Ever. Humans have literally tried to eat everything they have come into contact with. Why?
We have a different brain. We have a different experience. We have more possibilities and with that comes more opportunities to be @#$%^& up.
Yeah, Matt Monarch is a clear case of what under-carbing and over-fatting can lead to. Now he and Angela probably can't take a crap without an enema. It's a sad story.
I walked out of my parent's house at age 18 with a huge amount of optimism and grand plans for how happy I was gonna be now that I was out of that abusive environment. Then I spent the next 15 years totally TRYING to do exactly what Harley is telling you to do... change my identity, focus on the positive, follow my passion, etc and so on. And I was @#$%^& up and unhappy and self-destructive and eating disordered despite my best efforts. The last thing I wanted to do is yell at my children and shame them and try to control them like my parents did to me, and yet I found myself repeating those exact behaviors in moments of stress.
Through my efforts, I also found 80-10-10 and OA and NVC and a love of gardening and a job helping people.
So Harley's half-right. You do get to choose a new identity. Yes, focus on the positive. Yes, eating carbs and sleeping and drinking makes a difference. But it's just not as easy and quick as he's making it sound to be happy and fulfilled. Or maybe he's right and I'm just a dumb-ass who likes to be unhappy. LOL! Whatever.
Permalink Reply by fruitsandnumbers on I walked out of my parent's house at age 18 with a huge amount of optimism and grand plans for how happy I was gonna be now that I was out of that abusive environment. Then I spent the next 15 years totally TRYING to do exactly what Harley is telling you to do... change my identity, focus on the positive, follow my passion, etc and so on. And I was @#$%^& up and unhappy and self-destructive and eating disordered despite my best efforts. The last thing I wanted to do is yell at my children and shame them and try to control them like my parents did to me, and yet I found myself repeating those exact behaviors in moments of stress.
I would deeply appreciate if you could try to explain me why is it that things turned out so badly for you. This is really difficult for me to understand, so I'd be really thankful if you give me some light.
I think it's not about choosing a new identity, tough, but rather your own true identity, which has always been there buried deep inside you and craving for freedom.
Thx :)
love <3
Permalink Reply by Greenmama on Hi Daniel,
This is a great question! Without writing a book about it... the brain has this part of it called the amygdala. It records emotional information and it's number one job is safety. If at any point you become frightened or threatened, it hijacks your brain and moves into fight, flight or freeze. Your amygdala records everything about a situation if you are frightened or harmed. So, lets say your dad beats you. Your brain has recorded everything... the fact that he has a mustache, the smell in the room, everything. Even if you dissociate (blank out) during a trauma, your amygdala is recording. Why? To insure your survival! Survival is the most important thing to your brain. It wants to make sure it records this and helps you quickly protect you in such situations in the future.
So later on, even after the traumatic situation has been left behind, the amygdala is on hyper-alert and will hijack you into fight, flight or freeze when it senses similarities between the current situation and a former trauma. It generalizes broadly. The more severe and repeated the trauma, the more sensitive the amygdala. You can't figure out why you're freaked out by that guy at work with a mustache. He seems perfectly nice.
So, I had an abusive father and consequently I used to find it difficult to be around men or be in relationships with them because I was constantly getting triggered into fight, flight or freeze. (Just to be clear, I was in "fight" mode when I was yelling at my children. LOL!)
Luckily, trauma can be processed. Basically, there is a way for you to consciously go to that memory, and process it, taking it out of the amygdala and putting it into your hippocampus, where it can be a part of your narrative (life story) and in the PAST, rather than in the amygdala where it can become part of the present at any time.
Another part of the picture is core beliefs. These are basically things that were ingrained in you by your family, your schooling, your culture. They can be personal, like your mom telling you "You're stupid." and now you believe it. Or general, "It's important for women to be thin and beautiful." They can be positive or negative, but for the purposes of this discussion, we're talking about the negative ones. These also can be shifted. Unfortunately, most of the advice you hear about shifting your belief system is "Just do it." And that can be hard for people who have a ton of negative core beliefs. Luckily there are methods that are helpful and involve less shame and guilt.
Hope that helps! I have enjoyed your contributions to this conversation and this site a lot.
Hugs.
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